Grasshopper

Hi
Am I missing something? I've had my Grasshopper recumbent for nearly three years and done a few thousand miles......and I find it painfully slow and hard work. I can ride 50miles on an upright bike and hardly know I've had a ride, but on the recumbent I feel like I've ridden about a hundred miles!
Did I choose a particularly slow machine? Should I ditch the Scram Dual Drive?
Any views?
Tony

 

Welcome to the forum Tony.

I've also wondered some about this. I've been tempted to ride the Bianchi again just to see but it seems my bike just wants to go slow. Yet, I figured it was just the engine and not the bike.

I've never been a very fast rider and also started riding regular again last summer after a few years off, so I am blaming it on that and on age. But I keep on trying and having fun doing so.

 

Make sure your brakes aren't dragging. It will wear you out and you
won't even know they are dragging.

 

As Buddy and A.D. say. Plus, some bikes are slower and take more efffort to pedal than others. That's by design, it depends on the purpose the bike was designed for.

Between Laurie and I we have, or have had, 6 different 'bents all very different from each other (including 4 bikes and 2 trikes). There is no doubt that of the bikes, my 1st bent was slower and harder to pedal and my Ti-Rush is the fastest and easiest to pedal.

But then that 1st bent was designed to be mild-mannered, easy to ride, easy to reach the ground (16" front tire and 20" rear); while the Ti-Rush is designed for speed, performance, and high speed handling. It is easy to reach the ground also, however the ride is harsher and low speed handling is not as good. So handling/riding trade offs depending on intent of the bike.

 

while the grasshopper is a great machine for tooling around it isn't a fast bike. It is comparable to a upright comfort bike or hybrid that also had a nice soft rear suspension. The tires are wide enough to handle more surfaces and with lower air pressure provides a nice supple ride. The seating posiion is also very upright which doesn't provide very good aerodynamics. The praying mantis stye handlebars don't allow you to use your upper body to pull when climbing hills.

My wife has a HP Streetmachine which we both love but you can't compare it to a 18 or 19 lb road bike with 120 or 140 psi tires. The front suspension pogo's when I crank it up a steep hill but I can climb easier on it than my ti-Aero, just much slower. A long ride for my wife will usually see about a 10-11 mph adverage while still getting a fair workout

What you need for a fast recumbent:


Aerodynamic position, laid back seating with high Bottom Bracket
Stiff frame vertically to prevent power loss at the bottom bracket
Aero fork, aero wheelset with low-friction high pressure tires
High-end lightweight components including good brakes

and a good engine

If you are interested in seeing results of what fast recumbents can do go to Bacchettabikes.com and check out some of the results of these rides http://www.bacchettabikes.com/forum2/tt.asp?forumid=3

Ward

 

Or a performance oriented long wheelbase, low bottom bracket bike with a fairing ...

 

I'll agree with that also

hey Mike, do you ride with a sock at all and if so how do you like it.

Ward

 

Ward,

I've ridden with the tail sock a few times and I really like it. I haven't gotten up the nerve to try the full body sock yet. I'll let you know what I think once I do.

 

Hi All

Thanks for all the response! There was I thinking my question would simply disappear into the abyss!

As for things like brakes binding etc.....done all that stuff. There is a lot of resistance when revolving the cranks backwards. How much of this resistance is present when pedalling forwards, I don't know. Some of this resistance is coming from the freewheel/hub gear, but some is coming from the chain having to travel through the chain tubes. There is quite a curve in the lower/return path tube.....necessary in order to allow the chain to pass over the fork crown. I have grown to dislike the SRAM dual drive, and wish to convert the bike to the more usual set up with a tripple chain set......but wondering if this would improve the bike enough for me. This is where I'm at, at the moment. Wondering if I should simply go for a faster machine.

Regarding the 'engine'. OK, I'm not 'racing fit' these days......but I just ain't that unfit as to only be able to average around 10 mph on a days ride! On my bog standard hybrid I can average 15 mph easily. I've done a couple of 100 mile rides on the Grasshopper.....I was out on the road for 15 hours!! Albeit loaded with camping equipment and into the teeth of a head wind. A far cry from my time trialling days when a little over 4 hours would suffice for the same distance!

To sum up. I think most of the problem with the Grasshopper is due to the poorly engineered transmission, particularly the chain line. Anyone got a Sram Dual Drive hub?....I wondering how efficient these things are?

Tony

 

Tony,

I've had three of them over the years, all on bikes with 20" wheels. While not as efficient as (and considerably heavier than) a regular 3x9 derailleur bike they are not any where near as inefficient as the problems you describe.

I always used mine in conjunction with a tripple crank yielding an 81 speed bike. There is a lot of overlap in gearing with this setup. It boils down to having 5 chainrings on the crankset instead of 3 (at least the way I shifted them it worked like this). The net result being a very wide gear range even with a 20" drivewheel.

I'm wonderfing if there might be a problem with your particular hub or if something else is going on. I've never ridden a Grasshopper (I have ridden it's bigger brother the Street Machine Gte which is a sweet bike) however the reviews I've read about it don't fit with the problems you are having.

The reviews acknowledge that the Grasshopper is slower than the Street Machine but not to the extent you are experiencing.

I'd suggest that you have the bike looked at by someone who is familiar with both the Grasshopper and the Dual Drive hub before spending any more money on conversion. Something just doesn't add up.

 

I could hold 15-16 mph on my Cannondale hybrid before I switched to a Bachetta now when I push it 19 give or take alittle on short rides and on longer rides usually 17-18. I would be surprised if I could muster any better than 14 or 15 on a sustained ride on the Streetmachine.

Ward

 

I realise that I'm replying to an old thread but as an avid rider of the Grasshopper fx I feel I need to come to its defence!
I've been riding one for the past three years and done over 10,000miles on it. Mine is a fairly high-spec machine with the Rohloff IGH- expensive but IMHO worth the $$. For the first year I thought I had made a terrible mistake with this purchase- I live in a hilly part of the UK and ride with others on conventional bikes (not many "bents" out here) I'm reasonably fit for my age (62) and fairly light (c 160 LBS) but for at least a year I was always the last to get to the top of the hills but more than made up for it on the downhills! Since then my performance has improved progressively and now I keep up with (or beat) riders of my age on DF bikes on day rides of 30-80 miles. Last year I took the plunge and loaded it up with panniers and a GPS then headed of into Europe for a week. The trip took me via Paris then north through Belgium and Holland with a total of 630miles and average 80 miles per day. The bike as always performed perfectly even if the "engine" got a bit tired at times. I have the bodylink (narrow/hard) seat which I use in the fully reclined position, and it seems to get more comfortable year by year. I'm still on the original tyres (Marathon Plus) and have NEVER even had a puncture since new! From what I read these are not the free-est running tyres but I'm reluctant to sacrifice the puncture resistance!
I am thinking of buying another recumbent now though- a "Velomobile"-- mainly as a way of keeping warm in winter (it's been very cold here this year) and am heading off to Europe next week to visit some of the manufacturers and try some of the various options. Whatever I buy I intend keeping the GH as well though-- .

 

Glad to hear what you have to say. Thanks for responding!!!

 

Just a couple of observations:

Chaintubes are the bane of efficiency- If you can switch it to an idler that'd be better.

Gear drives are less efficient than deraillers (some are not to bad, but it is a loss)

If you're feeling major resistance when pedaling backwards it's time to look over your drivetrain and see where the striction is- Even with tubes and gear drives, it shoudn't be a major drag in freewheel.

The Grasshopper is a touring bike-not a performance machine- that said, I still don't think it should be that much slower. There's something wrong with the drivetrain.

Just my 2 cents.